to Zu-l-karnain
Это именно описание.
Что же касается второго вопроса - то это очень спорный момент. Воспоминания и идеи-то теоретически передавались не в одном только направлении - больше, конечно же, получил Фистандантилус от Рейстлина, но кое-что вполне мог получить и Рейстлин. Плюс я уверен, что он никогда не бросился бы назад просто так, не исследовав в полной мере тамошнюю ситуацию и не проследив деятельность Фистандантилуса в той мере, в которой это было возможно в его время.

Сообщение отредактировал Аваллах - 9-06-2007, 21:51

Можно еще раз... кто и что от кого получал? Просто у вас там явно опечатка.




Кстати, а разве они лично общались? Мне казалось, что он там ходил, но с Королем-Жрецом никогда не общался. Или он был его советником?


И можно точные слова из рулбука о духовной энергии Фистандантилуса, которой воспользовался Рейстлин?

Сообщение отредактировал Zu-l-karnain - 9-06-2007, 15:49

Да, Рейстлин фактически полностью заменил Фистандантилуса, который был советником Короля-Жреца. И потому общаться ему с ним пришлось.
Гм...а насчет духовной энергии Фистандантилуса я немного не понял - этот отрывок, пожалуй, наиболее точное описание Рейстлина после Войны Копья - могу еще выложить описание из War of the Lance.
P.S. Пост подправил - действительно легкая путаница вышла.

Выкладывайте.


Вот где это говорится в рулбуках?

Я их зауважал, эти рулбуки

Caramon and Raistlin Majere (after Xak Tsaroth, 351 AC), Warrior and Wizard
Male human fighter 6: CR 6; Medium humanoid (human); HD 6d10+18; hp 51; Init +0; Spd 20 ft.; AC 17, touch 10, flat-footed 17; Base Atk +6; Grp +10; Atk +12 melee (1d8+6/19-20, masterwork longsword) or +10 melee (1d4+4/19-20, dagger) or +10 melee (1d3+4/x2, unarmed strike); Full Atk +12/+7 melee (1d8+6/19-20, masterwork longsword) or +10/+5 melee (1d4+4/19-20, dagger) or +10/+5 melee (1d3+4/x2, unarmed strike); SA - ; SQ - ; AL LG; SV Fort +7; Ref +1; Will +1; Str 19, Dex 11, Con 17, Int 12, Wis 11, Cha 15.
Skills and Feats: Intimidate +10, Ride +8, Search +5, Spot +3, Survival +3. Cleave, Great Cleave, Improved Bull Rush, Improved Unarmed Strike, Power Attack, Quick Draw, Weapon Focus (longsword), Weapon Specialization (longsword)
Possessions: +1 chainmail, light steel shield, masterwork longsword, dagger, backpack, waterskin, whetstone.
Male human wizard 5/wizard of High Sorcery 1: CR 6; Medium humanoid (human); HD 5d4-5; hp 15; Init +3; Spd 30 ft.; AC 16, touch 16, flat-footed 13; Base Atk +2; Grp +1; Atk/Full Atk +3 melee (1d6+2/x2, Staff of Magius) or +4 melee (1d4+2/19-20, dagger of Magius); SA spells; SQ moon magic (Lunitari), spells, tower resources; AL N; SV Fort +0, Ref +4, Will +7; Str 9, Dex 16, Con 9, Int 18, Wis 12, Cha 10.
Skills and Feats: Concentration +5, Decipher cript +5, Heal +4, Knowledge
(arcana) +12, Knowledge (history) +10, Profession (herbalist) +8, Search +7, Sleight of Hand +7, Spellcraft +16, Use Magic Device +2 (+6 with scrolls); Brew Potion, Combat Casting, Magical Aptitude, Scribe Scroll, Spellcasting Prodigy, Spell Focus (enchantment)
Wizard Spells Prepared (4/4/4/3; save DC 13 + spell level, 14 + spell level w/enchantment spells): 0 - detect magic, ghost sound, prestidigitation, read magic; 1st - charm person, comprehend languages, identify, sleep; 2nd - darkness, detect thoughts, mirror image, web; 3rd - deep slumber, haste, slow.
Spellbook: 0 - all; 1st - burning hands, charm person, comprehend languages, floating disk, identify, magic missile, sleep; 2nd - arcane lock, darkness, detect thoughts, invisibility, knock, mirror image, see invisibility, web; 3rd - arcane sight, deep slumber, haste, hold person, slow.
Possessions: Staff of Magius, dagger of Magius, red robes, herbalist's supplies, scrolls, ink, writing supplies, spellbook of Fistandantilus.
Despite the fact that the warrior Caramon and the mage Raistlin are twins, the two men could not be more different. Caramon is open and honest, fun loving and jovial, handsome and powerfully built. By contrast, his
brother, Raistlin is slight in build, with a weak constitution. Known by the nickname, the "Sly One", Raistlin is withdrawn and secretive and always appears to be plotting something.
Caramon is a slow-thinker, requiring a great deal of time to consider a situation from all angles before he decides how to act. Raistlin possesses a lightningfast intelligence and a quick and caustic wit. Caramon is generally content to let Raistlin take the lead in making decisions. Caramon places little value on his own self-worth, mainly because his twin and others are always telling him he is "slow and stupid". In truth, he is quite intelligent. He just lacks self-confidence.
The twins have a love/hate relationship. Feeling only emptiness inside him, Caramon compensates by being overly protective of his weaker twin,
vicariously trying to live his life through his brother. Raistlin chafes beneath his twin's smothering affection, even as he exploits and uses Caramon. When it comes to battle, however, the two make an effective team - Caramon using steel and Raistlin sorcery to fight their foes.
The twins are halfbrothers to Kitiara uth Matar, who - at the age of eight - was responsible for caring for the newborns due to the frailty of their mother. Kitiara saw to it that both boys learned skills that would help them
survive as adults. She trained the strong Caramon to be a warrior and, finding that Raistlin was too weak to fight with conventional weapons, Kitiara saw to it that he had a weapon more suited to him - magic. The two are not particularly close to their half-sister, who ran away from
home at an early age.
Raistlin exhibited early in his life a powerful affinity for magic, so much so that he was one of the youngest mages ever invited to the Tower of High Sorcery in Wayreth to take the Test. Required of all mages who want to advance in their magic, the Test is designed to weed out those who
do not take magic seriously and who therefore might pose a danger to themselves, the community, and their fellow mages. The Test is a life-changing experience for all who take it and pass. Failure can end in death.
Opposing his brother's decision to risk his life by taking the Test, Caramon accompanied Raistlin on his journey to Wayreth and stubbornly insisted on remaining in the Tower while his brother took the Test. The details of what
happened to Raistlin and Caramon during the Test are not known, for the brothers refuse to speak of it. Although not noted for keeping secrets, Caramon will not discuss the Test under any circumstances, and always looks pale and troubled whenever it is mentioned.
All that is known is that Raistlin emerged from the Test with his health shattered—he coughs up blood and is forced to drink a special potion to ease his suffering. He oftentimes grows so weak during the casting of his spells that he comes close to passing out. His skin now has a golden sheen to it and the pupils of his eyes now have an hourlass shape. In order to teach the proud youth humility, he is cursed to see the passage of time in every living thing, be it plant, animal, or one of his fellow beings. He finds beauty in nothing, (with the possible exception of the long-lived elves), but sees all living things aging and dying. His hair went from auburn to white.
To compensate for his physical torment, Raistlin was given a powerful artifact—the staff of Magius, his most treasured possession. The Conclave determined that he would wear the Red Robes of neutrality, because of his
self-serving nature and his ambition, and the fact that he has always been a favorite of the goddess, Lunitari. In contrast to his twin, Caramon is the picture of health. He is burly and immensely strong from having done hard, physical labor in his youth. He is fond of his dinner and of strong spirits. With his wavy hair and handsome good looks, he is a favorite among women, who are attracted both by his strength and his sensitive nature.
Caramon remains loyal to his twin, however, even though Raistlin often does not appear to deserve such loyalty. Their friends find it difficult to accept and understand the twin’s relationship and hope that, one day, Caramon will emerge from his brother’s shadow.
War of the Lance (p. 245-247)
Специально выложил со статистикой - ибо тут как раз то промежуточное состояние Рейстлина, когда его мировозрение уже перешло от Нейтрально-Доброго к Нейтральному, но еще не достигло Нейтрально-Злого.
Заодно и перечень доступных ему базовых заклинаний на тот момент.
А о Владыке Прошлого и Настоящего написало на странице 100 книги Towers of the High Sorcery. Вообще одна из лучших книг по Кринну третьей редакции - там очень большой массив информации по всей истории Орденов, включая и четыре оставшихся башни.

Сообщение отредактировал Аваллах - 9-06-2007, 22:14

Может быть, вы соблаговолите запостить этот кусок? Или более подробно расскажете, что там написано?

Прошу прощения.. может показаться, что вопрос задан раздраженным тоном. Это не так

Сообщение отредактировал Zu-l-karnain - 9-06-2007, 22:36

Да на здоровье.

The Master of Past and Present

No living man would set foot within the Tower for more than three centuries. This was not for want of trying. Half a dozen wizards attempted to gain entry, proclaiming themselves to be the Master foretold by Andras. Two fled in humiliating terror when they tried to pass through the Shoikan Grove; the rest were never seen again, though their screams echoed from within the woods for days on end.
By the time of the War of the Lance, the people of Palanthas had learned to live with the dark, twisted Tower. Many Palanthians scarcely gave the Tower a second glance. Only the foreigners or the foolish dared approach it; the rest gave it a wide berth. Most, including many among the Orders, believed the Master of Past and Present would never come.
But come he did, after the war’s ending. Fresh from helping to defeat the Highlords and their dragonarmies at Neraka, Raistlin Majere — one of the legendary Heroes of the Lance, a Red Robe who had since taken the Black — approached the Tower in the dead of night, when only Nuitari rode high in the sky. He passed unmolested through the Shoikan Grove. As he stood before the gates, the cries of the Tower’s guardians woke the entire city.
No man had ever done such a thing and lived.
Raistlin did not die, however. Possessed by the spirit of Fistandantilus, he had become two people at once, the Master of both the Past and the Present. He proclaimed himself as such, and the gates opened, allowing him to enter. Within, he found the Portal. Thus the dying prophecy of Andras Rannoch was fulfi lled.
Rather than lifting the Tower’s curse, Raistlin left it in place, for he wanted to pursue his studies in secret. To the people of Palanthas, little had changed. Now and then, eerie lights and sounds would emanate from the Tower, but otherwise there was no sign that it was inhabited.
In his brief tenure as master of the Tower, Raistlin allowed only a handful of visitors to enter: the death knight, Lord Soth; his half-sister, the Highlord Kitiara Uth Matar; Lady Crysania, a priestess of Paladine; and, most importantly, his apprentice, Dalamar. A dark elf who had taken the Black Robes, Dalamar claimed he had a desire to learn from the greatest mage alive. In fact, he was an agent sent by the Conclave at Wayreth to spy on Raistlin. Raistlin knew this but still allowed Dalamar to dwell at the Tower.
Through the dark elf, the Conclave learned Raistlin’s plans. With the unwitting help of
Crysania, Raistlin would finish what Fistandantilus started. Traveling back in time, he would take the archmage’s place and become a god. This he did, and for the first and only time, Krynn’s history rewrote itself. Instead of Fistandantilus, Raistlin came to the Tower after the Cataclysm to search for the Portal. Not fi nding it, he fought the Dwarfgate War in the Dark One’s stead. Where Fistandantilus had perished at that war’s ending, however,
Raistlin survived, and he entered the Abyss with Crysania to confront Takhisis.
Meanwhile, in the present, Highlord Kitiara sought revenge against the Knights of Solamnia for thwarting her in the War of the Lance. Aided by Lord Soth and a fl ying citadel, she and her armies laid siege to Palanthas and broke down its gates. When she won through to the Tower, however, Dalamar — who had remained behind to await his master’s return — killed her with magic. Soon after, the Portal blazed to life as Raistlin prepared to fight the Queen of Darkness.
Before the battle could be joined, however, Caramon Majere, Raistlin’s twin brother, arrived at the Portal. Aided by two other Heroes of the Lance, Tanis Half-Elven and Tasslehoff Burrfoot, he commandeered Kitiara’s fl ying citadel and used it to fly to the Tower, bypassing the Shoikan Grove. Caramon entered the Tower and confronted
his brother, revealing to him that his ascent to godhood would lead to the destruction of Krynn. Raistlin knew Caramon spoke the truth. He sent his twin back to the mortal with the cleric Crysania, then closed the Portal, sealing himself in the Abyss. Thus his sacrifice saved the world.
After Raistlin’s demise, Dalamar became master of both the Tower of Palanthas and the Order of Black Robes. Unlike his predecessor, he did not choose to keep the Tower in seclusion. He lifted Andras’s curse. The Tower remained twisted and dark, and the Shoikan Grove continued to keep out common folk, but wizards traveled to it once more. Before long, a cadre of wizards, mostly Black Robes but also several Red, gathered to study with Dalamar. The Test resumed at Palanthas: Palin Majere himself became a wizard there. Once again, the mages stored lore and artifacts at the Tower, as they had in olden days.
For nearly thirty years, all was well at the Lorespire. But it also remained the Doom-spire, and its destiny would not be denied.

Сообщение отредактировал Аваллах - 9-06-2007, 22:47

Вот это я понимаю!
Только эта фраза меня смущает.

Только эта фраза меня смущает. Он вроде как сам думал. И ненавидел Фистандантилуса.

<Только эта фраза меня смущает. Он вроде как сам думал. И ненавидел Фистандантилуса>
У слова possessed достаточно много оттенков. Кроме того, в ролевой терминологии оно так же используется достаточно по-разному - означать оно может как прямое овладение (а-ля заклинание magic jar - когда жизненная энергия волшебника напрямую врывается в тело объекта заклинания), так и присутствие второго духа в теле живого существа.

Иными словами, в Трилогии Легенд это все же Рейстлин?

Это и Рейстлин, и Фистандантилус)
А вот кого там уже было больше...лично мое мнение - Рейстлина. Хотя ситуация остается достаточно спорной.

Это из-за того, что он получил память Фистандантилуса?
Лично мне всегда казалось, что от духа он избавляется в Истаре. А память и сила Фистандантилуса - это не часть личности, а ресурс.


Или еще раньше, из-за его духа?

Сложно сказать, сумел ли он от духа избавиться полностью. Память - тоже влияет на психику, причем достаточно сильно. Поэтому не знаю даже, можно ли вообще четко говорить о том, что после какого-то момента мы имеем "чистого" Рейстлина без частички Фистандантилса. Ибо силу можно отнести к ресурсам - память же является чем-то большим.

Ну скажем так.
1)Как я понимаю, слияние душ невозможно.
2)Если применено заклинание "соул джар", то душа отправляется ... ну куда-тоо далеко.

Но в Войне Душ именно Рейстлин. Следовательно, он избавился от Фистадантилуса как духа. Использовал его память, но духа не было.
Это логично?

Логично, однако сумел ли он полностью избавиться от Фистандантилуса?
Я еще раз повторюсь, что очень сложно провести грань между тем и другим - и если у Рейстлина сохранились воспоминания Фистандантилуса...то не остался ли он отчасти им. Ведь во многом на психику воздействует память - в том числе, полученные знания, навыки и умения. Поэтому поспорить с тем, что это в сути своей был Рейстлин я не могу, однако, на мой взгляд, от Фистандантилуса полностью избавиться он не смог до конца своего существования.

Какие заклинания использовал Рейстлин? Только, пожалуйста, не просто характеристики.

Ну вот я сделал вывод, что он любит молнии (он ими убил драконида в ДОС, много драконидов в ДВР и Гнимша) и не брезгует файерболами ( он использовал их во время прогулки с Карамоном). Но вот что за заклинание он использовал, когда сжег деревню? Чем он сражался с Фистадантилусом? Наконец, чем он уничтожал богов?

В первом представленном отрывке указана часть заклинаний Рейстлина...а точнее то, что было ему доступно на момент Войны Копья.
Могу выложить список на время Трилогии Близнецов.
Что же касается уничтожения богов...то там ситуация уже другая.
Рейстлин - бог. А их заклинаниям не меряют. Они выше базовой системы магии и работают напрямую с тканью мироздания. Да и об уничтожении богов я уже писал...их не заклинаниями убивают.
В большинстве своем.

Что-то я молнии не нашел. Но он точно ей пользовался

Конечно, вешайте. Если можно - с пояснениями

М-да, вывесил полную статистику, чтобы все могли сравнить с тем, что было во время Войны Копья.
Одно слово - впечатляет.
В принципе с заклинаниями все более или менее понятно - там по названиями можно разобраться. Набор, конечно же, мощнейший - одно Слово Силы: Убийство многого стоит (мгновенная смерть противника), не говоря уже об остановке времени, вытягивании жизненной энергии, телепортации, изгнании демонов и ледяных бурях. И это только подготовленные - так-то у него, фактически, присутствует на момент Трилогии Близнецов полный набор официальных заклинаний (которые известны большинству магов)+прекрасная возможность разрабатывать свои.
Действительно очень и очень сильно - что еще сказать...и это еще не считая подборки артефактов и специальных способностей.
P.S. Я боялся, что про знаменитые фокусы забудут...ан нет)
Prestidigitation наличествует))))

Raistlin Majere, Master of Past and Present CR 28
Male civilized human wizard 7/wizard of High Sorcery (Black) 7/loremaster 8/archmage 5, Master of the Tower of Palanthas
NE Medium humanoid (human)
Source Towers of High Sorcery (Master of the Tower template)
Init +3; Senses arcane sight, see invisibility; Listen +1, Spot +1
Languages Abanasinian, Common, Draconic, Elven, Infernal, Istaran, Magius, Nerakan, Solamnic; tongues
AC 26, touch 20, flat-footed 22; dodge trick
hp 44 (27 HD)
SR 26 (staff), 23 (when at Tower of Palanthas)
Fort +9, Ref +13, Will +20
Spd 30 ft.
Melee Staff of Magius +15 (1d6+1 plus arcane fire) or dagger of Magius +16 (1d4+2/19-20)
Base Atk +13; Grp +12
Atk Options weapon trick
Special Actions arcane fire (+15 ranged touch, 600 ft. range, deals 5d6 damage + 1d6 damage per spell level used to create, may be delivered through Staff of Magius), magic of darkness 3/day, magic of fear, magic
of pain 3/day
Combat Gear scrolls (mass cat’s grace, chain lightning (DC 22), mass hold person (DC 24), maximized lightning bolt (DC 19), mass suggestion (DC 24), summon monster VI, waves of fatigue; CL 26th)
Spells Prepared (CL 28th, +13 melee touch, +16 ranged touch, includes spell power +1, all spells of 3rd level or lower are quickened)
10th—maximized delayed blast fireball (DC 23)
9th—dominate monster (DC 26), energy drain (DC 26), power word kill, time stop
8th—demand, horrid wilting (DC 25), polar ray, protection from spells
7th—greater arcane sight, banishment (DC 23), destruction, greater teleport, maximized ice storm (DC 20), power word blind
6th—antimagic field, maximized lightning bolt (DC 19), planar binding (DC 22), shadow walk, mass suggestion (DC 23), undeath to death (DC 23)
5th—dominate person (DC 22), feeblemind (DC 22), maximized scorching ray, teleport, true seeing
4th—animate dead, bestow curse (DC 21), crushing despair (DC 21), divination, greater invisibility, phantasmal killer (DC 20)
3rd—clairaudience/clairvoyanceMT, deep slumber (DC 20), dispel magic, fireball (DC 19), hold person (DC 20), vampiric touch (DC 20), wind wall
2nd—detect thoughts, protection from arrows, gust of wind (DC 18), knock (2), resist energy (2), shatter (DC 18)
1st—endure elements, expeditious retreat, magic aura, sleep (DC 18), true strike (3)
0—ghost sound, prestidigitation (2), touch of fatigue (DC 17)
Abilities Str 9, Dex 16, Con 9, Int 22, Wis 12, Cha 10 SQ arcane research +3, dodge trick, high arcana, lore +15, loremaster secrets (applicable knowledge, dodge trick, more newfound arcana, weapon trick), moon
magic (Nuitari), order secrets, permanent resistance (included), improved tower resources
Raistlin has chosen not to take an arcane focus as a Wizard of High Sorcery.
Feats Automatic Quicken Spell, Brew Potion, Combat Casting, Magical Aptitude, Improved Spell Capacity
(10th), Maximize Spell, Quicken Spell, Reserves of Strength, Scribe Scroll, Skill Focus (Knowledge [arcana]), Skill Focus (Spellcraft), Spellcasting
Prodigy, Spell Focus (enchantment), Spell Focus (necromancy)
Skills Concentration +29, Craft (alchemy) +18, Decipher Script +19, Heal +9, Intimidate +10, Knowledge (arcana) +42, Knowledge (history) +16, Knowledge (the planes) +30, Knowledge (religion) +20, Profession
(herbalist) +11, Search +16, Sleight of Hand +10, Spellcraft +46 (+48 with scrolls), Use Magic Device +11 (+15 with scrolls)
Possessions combat gear plus bracers of armor +6, Staff of Magius (+2 spell-storing quarterstaff, see below), dagger of Magius (+3 silver dagger, undetectable by magic or searches when carried), black robes, herbalist’s supplies, scrolls, ink, writing supplies, traveling chest (trapped with CR 8 power word stun trap), dragon orb
Spellbook: As the Master of the Tower of Palanthas, Raistlin has access to all common and unnamed spells from the Player’s Handbook, DRAGONLANCE Campaign Setting and other d20 DRAGONLANCE sourcebooks.
Black Robe Order Secrets (Su): Magic of Darkness 3/day (half the damage dealt by a chosen spell is negative energy damage), Magic of Fear (as full round action, cast any spell that deals damage and is normally a
standard action in order to demoralize one target within 30 ft., Intimidate check gains bonus equal to spell level), Magic of Pain 3/day (spell that deals hit point damage causes target to suffer –2 penalty to attack rolls, skill checks, and ability checks for 1 round, Fort save DC 10 plus spell level negates, caster takes 1d6 damage).
High Arcana: Arcane fire, mastery of counterspelling (countered spells are turned back upon the caster), mastery of elements (change energy descriptor of spell cast), mastery of shaping (may create holes or
unaffected areas within the area of spells cast), spell power +1.
Raistlin has permanently sacrificed one 5thlevel, one 6th-level, one 7th-level, one 8th-level and one 9th-level spell slots to master these abilities.
Lore (Ex): A loremaster has the ability to know legends or information regarding various topics, just as a bard can. The loremaster makes a lore check with a +15 bonus.
Master of the Tower Traits: Raistlin may prepare one bonus spell per level from the Knowledge, Magic or Necromancy cleric domains as arcane spells when he prepares his other spells at the Tower, and gains spell resistance 23 within the Tower of Palanthas.
Staff of Magius: This +2 spell-storing quarterstaff was made famous by the legendary wizard Magius, but truly came into its own through its use by Raistlin Majere. The following abilities reflect the additional power unlocked by Raistlin, and replace the base statistics provided on page 90 of the DRAGONLANCE Campaign Setting.
The staff grants the bearer spell resistance 23, a +6 deflection bonus to AC, and any spell cast by the bearer with the mind-affecting, air, or light descriptors may be extended, empowered, or enlarged as if the staff were a greater metamagic rod. Only one metamagic effect may be used on any given spell, but each effect may be used up to three times per day, and does not alter the level of the spell. In addition to its spell-storing quality, an archmage with the arcane fire ability may deliver his arcane fire damage through the staff as a melee touch attack. The staff has the following additional powers usable at will—feather fall (on the bearer only), daylight (on the staff). CL 18th.

Даже вас восхитило)
Что там с видением Ладонны, Пар-Салиана и Юстариуса?